Yaël Vias Gvirsman during our interview in Geneva. 28 September 2017. Photo by author Marie Bohner. As a legal professional, is it possible to reflect on the ways in which court decisions affect populations who have lived together — and continue to live together — after a conflict? How can this awareness of complex social situations influence national and international law? These are just a few of the many questions addressed in current efforts to adapt and evolve the law, specifically, with the introduction of transitional justice, or “judicial and non-judicial measures implemented in order to redress legacies of human rights abuses”. With this in mind, Yaël Vias Gvirsman founded the International Criminal and Humanitarian Law Clinic — the first of its kind in Israel. The country, which was referred to as an ‘occupying power’ by UNESCO, is at the very least, a territory plagued by conflict. Gvirsman seeks to lend her honed expertise to the international development of transitional justice. Here is our exclusive interview with a woman who isn't afraid to clash with the norm in order to create a better world. Yaël Vias Gvirsman (YVG): The International Criminal and Humanitarian Law Clinic is based in The Interdisciplinary Center Herzliya (IDC) north of Tel Aviv, Israel. I founded it in 2014, after returning from The Hague where I worked as a lawyer for the ICC's (International Criminal Court) defense teams. I witnessed a distinct lack of Israeli lawyers there, despite prevalent specialisations in my country in international humanitarian law, conflict law and occupation law. There is extensive legal precedent for the application of international humanitarian law in Israel and, as such, it is important to provide future Israeli lawyers the apolitical and non-partisan judicial tools to be successful. This is a challenge in and of itself. We have to go further than political speeches and reports in the media in order to hone their critical minds. They must ask themselves: what is the law? What are the challenges in pursuing the law? What is certain and what is uncertain? YVG: We have a weekly core curriculum throughout the year-long program in international criminal law, which focuses on international humanitarian law and transitional justice — the latter being a new project the clinic took on last year. We reflect comparatively on the potential effects that legal and non-legal mechanisms, both international or national, can have on conflict. We also analyze foreign conflicts so that we might discern what information could be useful for our conflict. YVG: We start by defining the principles, studying the classic examples of Argentina, South Africa etc. We reflect on how these societies have looked to the past in order to take a step forward. How have they left vengeance and blame behind? It is true that injustice exists, that doesn't mean that we don't see it, but instead we look at it in a constructive way. We do this to offer future generations an alternative. YVG: With regards to transitional justice, [which includes all measures that go towards correcting human rights abuses], we teach our lawyers about the potential effects of their future actions. If the lawyer then finds themselves in a court like the ICC, they will have a better understanding of the affected population. The involved parties live in a territory that was given to them before any ICC action, and will remain there long afterwards. As such, they must be able to continue living together after a resolution. The practical aspect is that we don't just run a course; It's still a legal clinic. Our students are divided into small groups of between 2 and 4. These groups work with external non academic parties, or practitioners, such as subsidiaries of the ICC, like the International Criminal Court for former Yugoslavia (ICTY) and the Extraordinary Chambers in the Courts of Cambodia (ECCC). These groups could also work with interstate entities like the Internacional Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) — who are one of our most important partners — or other governmental practitioners, like independent lawyers and NGOs, or, finally, civilians and victims. Our students need to be exposed as much as possible to the diverse array of practitioners that exist. YVG: Certain case files involve a dispute of some sort. For example, we worked with the ICTY‘s defence team on the case of Goran Hadžić. We worked on the problem of the definition and extent of the crime of forced human displacement.